Sebastian Jimenez - Taking Sales Calls to the Next Level with AI - PODCAST TRANSCRIPTION

Editor's note: The following is the transcript of a live interview with Sebastian Jimenez from Rilla. You can read the interview below or listen to the podcast.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: Hello, and welcome to MetalCast for MetalCoffeeShop. My name is Heidi Ellsworth, and we're here today to talk about one of the leading topics in technology today, and that is AI. And who would know, who would think that AI is playing such a huge role in construction and in the metal construction industry. So we had to invite Sebastian Jimenez to this MetalCast to find out what is going on with voice activation, with AI. So many great things. Sebastian, welcome to the show.

Sebastian Jimenez: Thank you. Thank you for having me on, Heidi. Super excited to be here and super excited to share a lot of good stuff.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: You are on the cutting edge, and I am really excited to hear about it. Before we get started, go ahead and introduce yourself and tell us a little bit about Rillavoice.

Sebastian Jimenez: Yeah, so I'm Sebastian Jimenez. I am the founder and CEO of Rillavoice. We are the leading speech analytics software for the roofing or home improvement industry. And what that means is when salespeople go out and talk to their customers in homes or their businesses, if you're doing commercial, they record their conversations with the Rillavoice mobile app that they can activate from their phones or tablets, just like a mobile app.

And then we use AI to automatically transcribe, analyze, and give them feedback to help them improve their sales and to help them get better at talking to customers. And very succinctly, what Rilla does is it looks at patterns for how the top performing salespeople in a team talk, how fast, how much, how many questions do they ask, and then it looks at what they say specifically to then share those winning conversational patterns across the entirety of the team. So you can have a team of, like an entire team stacked with superstars and top performers. So yeah, that's Rilla.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: It's really using technology to help people succeed. And you know what? It's helping the homeowners, too, because they're getting the best experience.

Sebastian Jimenez: Yeah. One of the things that we realized was we have, there's a measure that our customers measure with Rilla, which is their brand compliance or sales process compliance. And that's the first metric that starts to go up. And if you're any kind of brand, the biggest thing that you should care about is your customer experience and how your company is interacting with your customers.

And so when we have tools like this that enable human beings to become the best version of themselves with technology, you end up seeing a great benefit to customers, which shows up in sales and growth and profitability. It's all because you're serving your customers better. So yeah, totally.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: It's a win. So tell us, Sebastian, how did this start? How did Rillavoice ... I love these stories of innovation and entrepreneurship.

Sebastian Jimenez: Yeah, so how did I start? I went to NYU for college. When you go to NYU, there's an ever pressing question every day, which is, how can I piss off my parents and how can I optimize the anger that my parents are going to feel when I tell them what I did today? And my way of doing that was to skip classes and go and do standup comedy in New York City. And I became an avid addict of going out and telling crappy jokes in crappy bars in New York City.

And I would do all these shows, and I kind of became addicted to this craft of going out. There's nothing on a piece of paper, you write something down, you tell it to people and launch it. You fail in public a lot, and then you get feedback from that failure and you go back and iterate and try it again, and you iterate and try it again until it gets good. I became addicted to that.

And I remember, I'm from the Dominican Republic, so technology's not like a thing down there that you can think of doing in your life. And so I never knew about it, but I was in New York, I had this internship with this Forbes author. We started interviewing a bunch of tech founders, and when they described their process for building companies and products, it was very similar to what I was doing in standup, just this idea of every tech founder, they start with an idea. It can be right in the right general direction, but it's so wrong on so many different ways.

Like Airbnb, they started, the general concept was right, but they started going into conferences. They started selling to people where the hosts had to be in the home for them to be able to operate an Airbnb. They started in so many different wrong ways, and it wasn't until a bunch of trial and error over an extended period of time that they actually got it right. And so I started learning about that. I said, okay, that sounds very similar. I could probably get addicted to that, too. And I did. And then I figured out something that I could do that could piss off my parents even more, which is like, okay, instead of being a standup comedian, I'm going to become a tech entrepreneur. At least they knew what a standup comedian was. It's like, okay, you're a clown.

But then with tech, they didn't even know what that was. They were like, this kid, they just gave up. It was like, this kid is so annoying. He's now going, they couldn't even tell their friends, like, oh [inaudible]. My mom just said, "You're just unemployed, right? You're just dumb," and whatever. "Just come back home whenever you're ready to grow up," or whatever. And so I became a tech entrepreneur. My first, I want to be an entrepreneur, of course, you know?

Heidi J. Ellsworth: Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Sebastian Jimenez: And my first company, after a lot of trial and error, it turned into a field marketing management software to companies, like consumer companies like Heineken and Molson Coors and Getaround and Red Bull, that would do field marketing. Field marketing in home improvement is when you go to the home shows and you try to get leads for consumer companies that sell beverages. It's more like you send a bunch of college kids to a store or to an event, and they give you Red Bull, and then you're just like, "Oh, Red Bull's fun," because you have a bunch of young kids that are all happy giving you a Red Bull.

And our software was this very basic management software to schedule the events, get data from the event. And one day I was just looking at some numbers and I realized that one of our customers, Heineken, they had like four million face-to-face conversations with consumers every single month.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: Geez.

Sebastian Jimenez: And that was 10 times more data than they were capturing from social media analytics on a monthly basis. Social media analytics was about 500,000 points of engagement from YouTube, Instagram, Facebook. Every like, every comment, every mention of their brand was 500,000 points of engagement when offline, they had these four million face-to-face conversations. And I said, what if we could take those four million conversations and allow Heineken to get really close to their consumers, understand what they want, what they need, what problems they have with their brand, so that they can make better products and services and marketing strategies?

And then we said, that's only Heineken. What if we go into all of field marketing? How many conversations there? What if we get out of field marketing? We go to the field salespeople that go in selling pharma, medical, home improvement, roofing, windows, siding, doors, flooring, HVAC, solar [inaudible]. There's all these different salespeople out there. How many conversations are they having? And it's about 10 billion face-to-face conversations that are happening.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: Geez.

Sebastian Jimenez: And for context, there's 80 billion Google searches at the time that we were doing the numbers, it's like 10 billion versus 80 billion. We said, what if we could go out there and make offline commercial interactions as searchable as what Google did for the web? And that became the founding vision for Rilla.

It's like, let's go out there and bring the power of the internet to the offline world where most people still work today. And that was a few years ago. And like I said, the concept was right. It was a lot of failure in between. And it took us a couple of years to figure it out. And then we finally did, and now we've become one of the fastest-growing startups in the world in history, which is a good spot.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: Yeah, it's a great spot. And it makes so much sense. I mean, you're right. It's all these conversations we have every day that are not being transcribed, that are not on the internet, that are really forming the relationships and the sales and everything else that goes along with that.

And so AI, everybody's talking about it, and it's like good, bad, and indifferent. So as you're using this AI for all these conversations, what are you seeing with that in home improvement, because you are working with Heineken and now you're working with roofing or metal? It's kind of different.

Sebastian Jimenez: I would actually say that in home improvement, one of the reasons why we've been growing so fast in this market, and this is kind of odd for people in New York and Silicon Valley, home improvement companies in particular are incredibly tech savvy and just highly sophisticated businesses, because it's just like, it's a highly competitive industry where homeowners, if you're selling residential, are only going to make a purchase once or twice in their lifetime for your target market.

So the best companies and the companies that are aspiring to be the best companies have to be insanely sophisticated when it comes to marketing, when it comes to sales, when it comes to customer service and branding. And so you have these highly sophisticated businesses that are powered by technology. Drone technology was actually adopted by a lot of home improvement companies that were the early adoption, that kind of found its footing there.

And of course, it's not going to be featured in TechCrunch because VCs are not on Twitter talking about it, but just because VCs are not talking about it on Twitter doesn't mean that it's not-

Heidi J. Ellsworth: Happening.

Sebastian Jimenez: ... a really important part of the economy. Not it's just happening, it's huge. Just roofing alone, it's like what, a $60 billion industry or something like that?

Heidi J. Ellsworth: Yeah, and everybody needs one. So there you go.

Sebastian Jimenez: Yeah. So I would actually say that some of these CPT companies are more risk averse when it comes to technology than home improvement companies. And you see it in the tech stack. You see that home improvement companies, they have everything from drones. When AR technology, I've met people who launched companies when the Google glasses came out, first companies that they started targeting was like field service technicians for HVAC, people doing inspections. This is a big, and to your question about AI, we're seeing that the same thing is happening with AI, where people think that AI is going to be adopted by Silicon Valley companies.

And what's actually happening now is that there's a moment in time that's happening right now where Silicon Valley is suffering right now for the last 10 years in a very low interest rate economy that we were living in. You as a tech company, it was a very easy path to just become a tech company by selling products to other tech companies. And that just became the norm because what would happen is VCs had a portfolio, very large portfolio of tech companies, and if you were a startup in Silicon Valley you would just come and say like, "Hey, I have this little plugin for your thousands of portfolio companies that they can use to make their little videos a little bit better." You know what I mean?

Heidi J. Ellsworth: Yeah.

Sebastian Jimenez: Value at like a billion dollars. Interest rates go up and that entire economy, that entire pyramid just falls to crap. And SaaS companies are suffering. Companies that are selling to tech companies are suffering. And this is happening at the exact same time that AI became available. Like GPT Chat happened September last year. And so both things are happening at the same time.

So what's happening is because we're in a high interest rate economy now, you can't just be a tech company selling tech to other tech companies. It's just like the party's over. You have to go out and sell to real businesses that are selling real products to real people in the economy. And home improvement because of this nature of the business that they have to be very competitive and tech savvy, they're kind of at the forefront of AI technology now, not only with tools like Rilla. A very basic use case of the new AI, it's replacing the call center. Like you call somebody, it's a machine who answers, not a human being. And it sounds like a human being. It quacks like a human being, but it's not.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: Until you ask that one question, what they don't like, and then you're like, oh, it's not a real person.

Sebastian Jimenez: Yeah, yeah, exactly. But there's a lot of technologies that are not just implementing AI, but are specifically targeting home improvement first because of this kind of market chip that's happening. And so it's really cool to see, and that's obviously great for Rilla, because we target home improvement companies and they're very quick to launch these techs. So we're seeing it with all sorts of technologies across the board.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: Yeah. Well, I first met you and saw you at the top 500 last year. We had Sherwin Williams, and MetalVue had a booth, and MetalCoffeeShop was there, and you guys were right next to us. So yeah, I mean those top 500 exterior contractors are doing things that are just amazing. I mean, with what they're using around technology. So the adoption that you're hearing from those kind of big companies, tell us just a little bit about that. How are they embracing it and bringing it into their business?

Sebastian Jimenez: Okay, perfect question. So they're using tools like Rilla. So Rilla, what it allows you to do fundamentally is to do virtual ride-alongs that are a hundred times faster, better, and more efficient than doing traditional physical ride-alongs. And it was one of our large customers, I won't say his name because he's one of the best people in home improvement that we've met, an amazing person.

And when we launched Rilla, he said it in an amazing, beautiful way, which was he told his team, he's like, "Listen, I've been in this business for over 40 years, and in those 40 years, everything has changed. We've changed the way that we've done marketing. We had to move from mailing campaigns. We send things in the mail, door knocking, to being really adept at SEO and online marketing. We've changed our call center, we've changed our sales process, we've changed the windows that we sell we've changed. Everything about our business has changed. The only thing that hasn't changed is the way that we coach and manage salespeople."

40 years ago, the same as today. The only way to coach and manage a salesperson is they're having trouble, you send the sales manager out on a ride-along, the sales manager sees them selling, give some feedback. And that's been the same for 40 years, until today, where for the first time in 40 years, we're actually changing the way we coach or manage our salespeople because now we can do it virtually. And this is an amazing kind of early adopter feeling of we're growing out there to the cutting edge.

And so they're embracing it like that. This is actually changing a very specific part of our business that has, it was just like a given that we have to do physical ride-alongs. And so but not only with Rilla, like the call center company that I was mentioning, there's a company called Invoca. Sorry, Avoca. No, not Avoca. It's Invoca or Avoca.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: Okay, I love it.

Sebastian Jimenez: I'm trying to, yeah, it's basically the fundamental premise is like what I said, it's like the call center answers a phone. It's a machine. And home improvement companies are adopting that first than anybody else. And they're at the forefront because, again, they're super highly competitive businesses, have to be highly sophisticated in sales and marketing. And we're seeing just a lot of, with scheduling, there's AI being used with presentation. My buddy Dean Curtis from Ingage-

Heidi J. Ellsworth: Yeah, love that stuff.

Sebastian Jimenez: They're adding AI to design your presentation. So it's really, it's taking over in a big way, in a fast way, and it's being adopted by the top players, which is great to see because it's like when the history books are written, they're going to look back and say, okay, just like the first people to adopt electricity were the bankers in New York, well, the first people to adopt AI were the roofers going out there.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: I'm telling you-

Sebastian Jimenez: In Ohio.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: I was just with a contractor last week who was using chat to create his SOPs. So this isn't just for sales and marketing, this is job descriptions, you name it, everything. But you know what, a lot of what I've seen, and it's interesting because you have a lot of owners who tend to be visionaries, and they are adopting and they're saying, "We're bringing this software in."

But then it's always curious to me, how does it work down through the organization? So just what are you hearing back from sales managers who all of a sudden have this new way of doing things, who have been doing it the other way for so long?

Sebastian Jimenez: So we have two types of sales managers. We have sales managers that are still keeping their sales rep hat on, and we have sales managers that have become fully in their brain, and then they're sold. They become sales managers and sales trainers, sales managers that are sales trainers, sales managers fully, they absolutely, they're the Rilla champions.

I mean, the first time we realized we had something after years of toiling away in darkness and misery, it was a sales manager from the Storm Guard roofing company, one of our first customers in home improvement. I love you guys, Storm Guard. The sales manager basically told us, we said, "How did it go your first week of using Rilla?" And he said, "Listen, in my 10 years of sales, I've never seen a tool that's saved me so much time, which is the only thing I can't get back."

And I said, "Tell me more about it." And like, "Last week, I went on my ride-along, it took me six hours. Today with Rilla, I was able, and then last week I was only able to coach one rep. Today with Rilla, I was able to coach all my five reps." And I was like, "Oh, wow, that's awesome. That's a five times improvement."

He said, "No, last week it took me six hours to coach that one rep. Today, it took me about 50 minutes to review all the analytics, all the appointments for all of my five reps in less than 50 minutes." So we're actually talking a 30 to 35X increase in the productivity of your sales managers. So when you show that to sales managers and you show that to big companies, you were asking me how big companies are adopting, what you have the opportunity to do, and we have many customers doing this, is that they kind of restructure their companies in such a way that now that they ... One of the problems that we didn't know that we were solving was that when you're growing a company and you're trying to expand to multiple territories, one of the biggest constraints is hiring top world-class sales management talent to actually build teams and scale teams in that region.

The problem is that you're constrained by the territory because you have to hire somebody who's either traveling there all the time on a plane, we see a lot of that, or somebody who's local. Now all of a sudden with Rilla, these companies that are at the top of their game, they kind of lean into the corporate trainer position where you now need, you have a team of top one percent corporate trainers in the entire world, and they're sitting in a corporate location, or wherever, actually, they could be in Mexico, they could be anywhere. They could be-

Heidi J. Ellsworth: I love it.

Sebastian Jimenez: ... in The Bahamas. And they're just coaching your teams, and then you're now able to devote coaching resources to whatever markets need it the most without having to be constrained. So for sales managers that are in that vertical, it's amazing. For sales managers who are thinking like sales reps, sales reps, when you first introduce Rilla to them, the top performing sales reps who tend to become sales managers, they absolutely hate it. They absolutely hate it completely. And it makes sense. The tool is kind of designed to find their secret sauce and share it. I understand.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: That makes it, yeah.

Sebastian Jimenez: I understand.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: They don't want everybody else to know.

Sebastian Jimenez: Yeah, yeah, no. If you're a top performer and you get introduced to Rilla the first time, you absolutely could, you absolutely hate it. Everybody who's in the middle of the pack, they are slightly concerned about it. They're like, "Okay, big brother, what the hell is this? This is like Zuckerberg's behind this. He's going to come out of the phone." And so they're kind of slightly concerned.

And then what we see with salespeople is that usually the bottom of a pack and the new reps embrace it faster than everybody else because just by sheer necessity, they need any help they can get and they want to improve. And so they embrace it. And what typically happens is first month of using Rilla, those people who embrace it the fastest, we have a bunch of case studies, and it happens time and time and again, they improve their sales by 30 or 40% on average, first few months.

And then when that happens, and a lot of the times what happens is the top performers [inaudible]. And when that happens, it's kind of like when Steph Curry and the Golden State Warriors just started throwing three point shoot, literally just [inaudible] the crap out of everybody. Everybody's like, "Yo, hold up. What is going on?"

And then everybody has to be like, "Okay, we need to practice the three points." It becomes that kind of dynamic where everybody realizes, okay, the game just changed, and if I want to be at the top of my game, I need to do this. And then what we see is that the top performers then embrace it and then become the power users, and then they start improving by 15, 20% from their baseline, which was already really high. So yeah-

Heidi J. Ellsworth: They need to be pushed a little bit from the bottom.

Sebastian Jimenez: Oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. The top performers are certainly not the first ones to be like, "Hooray, I get to share my secret sauce with everybody now."

Heidi J. Ellsworth: They need to listen to everything I'm doing. No, no. I know.

Well, okay, so along that line, on MetalVue, which is a program that's out from Sherwin-Williams that is taking the cream of the crop technology and strategy, consulting, training, all of that, and really helping contractors to sell more metal. I mean, bottom, end of the line, sell more metal roofs. And you've just, Rillavoice has just become a part, I think in the last couple months, has become a part of MetalVue.

Tell me a little bit about, I mean, now just listening to you, Sebastian, I'm like, my mind is whirling. I'm thinking yeah, for a salesperson who maybe really knows how to sell shingles or maybe they really know how to sell windows, now all of a sudden you throw metal roofing in there and say, "We're going to sell metal roofing." This can really help them get there fast.

Sebastian Jimenez: Right. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, the program is, by the way, really, really cool. The fact that you're trying to help regular exterior contractors to become metal roofs. Metal roofs are great, high margin, high profitability, great-

Heidi J. Ellsworth: Long lasting, yeah.

Sebastian Jimenez: Yeah, yeah, yeah, great market, great market for that, especially with, it's also kind of recession-proof in a way because the people who buy metal roofs tend to have deep pockets. For contractors-

Heidi J. Ellsworth: They do. They do.

Sebastian Jimenez: And so one of the things that we see is the transition to selling metal roofs is kind of like the transition to selling, it's like when you're an insurance roofer going into selling retail roofing, it's like you have to sharpen your skills massively because you're going from insurance, when insurance, it's just like, "Hey, we got you a roof for free, man. Do you want to take it?"

Heidi J. Ellsworth: Yeah, exactly, exactly.

Sebastian Jimenez: How about your insurance is going to pay for it, and it's just like walking, like the wholesale in insurance is like, "Trust me, this is not a scam. I can get you that roof for no down payment. Your insurance is going to pay for it."

Heidi J. Ellsworth: Yeah, yeah, yeah, I know. And then people are like, "What?" Well, unless you live in Colorado and you get one every year.

Sebastian Jimenez: Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. So they're like, "Huh?" So it becomes a fundamentally different sale when you're actually having to, hey, it's your cash, you're going to have to pay $20,000 for that roof. And they're like, "Huh?" 6,000, $10,000. So it's kind of like that because usually metal roofs, you have to sell the value about why you have to switch into it. It's a new concept, it's a new technology almost that's being adopted, and it's becoming very popular.

And it's kind of like you have to make the case to the customer and selling them the concept. And it's a great concept to sell because at the end of the day, it is better for the customer, long lasting. It's better for the company, higher profit margins. So it's just having to train and coach your salespeople to have to sell something that's a little bit harder to sell because it's a little bit higher price. But then how do we sell that concept to the customer? And selling that concept becomes a difficult thing, and it's like sharpening those sales scales so that you can do that appropriately. So yeah, it's a great, yeah.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: What I love, too, is this combination, because I'm just thinking of what Grosso University is doing right now with just sales training and LMS and where people can really learn. And so once they get through this class selling, and I have to say, CCN, Certified Contractor Network, is also doing training and helping contractors.

Sebastian Jimenez: Oh, that's awesome.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: [inaudible], right?

Sebastian Jimenez: Yeah.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: And so once they get this training, then by incorporating Rillavoice into their program, you can kind of figure out what did they hear? What did they catch? How did that training go? How do we have to tweak the training, too? So to me, it's not just the person, but it's also the tools that we're giving to the people to really understand how effective they are.

Sebastian Jimenez: Yeah, we've had a great partnership with Grosso, that you mentioned, for a while now, and we love that kind of partnership because the whole point of Rilla is that you're going to make your sales coaches bionic and better at doing what they're naturally great at, which is coaching and training, not just driving to the home and sitting there for hours.

We've seen customers, exterior contractors with Grosso. There was one who actually started piloting this concept with us, which is what Grosso does, is they have world-class sales coaches that are remote, and what they'll do is they'll put your team on Rilla and they'll coach them on the Grosso training. We'll give them the training, they'll put them on Rilla, and they'll see how they follow the proper reception, the sales process, and how to talk to customers and what to say specifically to create an amazing customer experience. And then they can coach hundreds of reps remotely at scale.

So it's become kind of like a sales coach as a service, the program that they have, and they'll actually help your sales managers, if you have a sales manager, become bionic. If you don't have a sales manager, you go to Grosso and use them as your sales manager as a service.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: Get one.

Sebastian Jimenez: Yeah. And it's become a great concept. We have a contractor, which literally goes into the concept of selling metal roofs, they improved their conversion rates by 40% in the first month. And all of what the Grosso coaches were coaching them to do was you go in there to sell a window and you come out of there with a full package of things that you're selling that customer because you're upselling, because the customer goes online, they have a pressing need for a window, but when they get a trained design consultant who goes there and can see things that the customer might not know themselves that need fixing or that need replacement, you go in there, the metal roof that they might not have heard of, but it's super high quality, it's going to make the value of their home better over time.

You go in there to sell one and you come out of there with a full package, and you just raise your average ticket by 10 times. And so yeah, we've literally seen this happen already with companies that just by coaching them to upsell, you can generate much more profitability for your business.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: You know what? There's a need, and whenever there's a need, because people don't have the time, they don't want to go out and have to go to 10 different companies to get 10 different things going. So once you build that trust with one contractor, you're just like, "Yeah, you can. Yeah, we need a roof. Yeah, we need siding. We need an outdoor living space," whatever it may be. And I think that is very much part of the times that we're in, just in how busy people are, and so gaining that trust, and I love the fact that you can figure out if they're missing that step or not.

Sebastian Jimenez: Oh, yeah. You can literally track if the rep is even asking for the sale, asking for the upsell, are you even attempting? A lot of the times, people love to buy things. They just hate being sold to. And you'll be surprised that if you just ask people, like, "Oh, I see that you have this roof is looking a little bit old. Have you ever thought about?" It was like, "Oh, actually, yeah, I was thinking. I didn't know you guys." And you just open up a can of worms just by asking for it. You'd be surprised by the amount of average reps or reps that are underperforming that just simply don't ask for the sale. It's crazy.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: It is crazy. Oh my gosh. Okay, Sebastian, this has been the best MetalCast. I have to tell you, I have loved this. I love what you're doing. And so I always like to end it with how can contractors get involved with you? Give them a little bit of how to get started.

Sebastian Jimenez: Yeah. So you go to rillavoice.com, that's rillavoice.com, and you go on the signup link. It's going to ask you a bunch of questions, your company, your name, your email, your phone number, and then it's going to ask you to book a demo with one of our highly trained salespeople, who have been trained using AI.

So you book that demo and you tell us how we did at training those people. I swear to God, it is actual human beings. We still haven't cracked the code to make the Zoom call a machine yet, so it's actual human beings that will talk to you, but we've trained them with the best of AI technology. You tell us how we did.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: I was going to ask that. I was going to ask is it a real person or, okay. The other question that everyone out there has to be asking right now because I know I'm thinking about it, is how are your parents, did they survive all this?

Sebastian Jimenez: My parents, what I'll say is we were featured, I was selected as one of these Forbes lists. They keep coming out with more lists. And I think we're about to, oh, I can't talk about it because it's not yet ... Another one's going to come out. But we were selected in one of these other lists from Forbes, and my mom told all her friends that her son Sebastian was featured in the cover of the New York Times, which is like wrong newspaper, wrong newspaper, but still in the spirit. I appreciate it, because now in her mind I'm not unemployed. I'm in the New York Times, which different newspaper, but whatever. You know what I mean? We'll take it.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: And you're still funny. So I mean, it's all come together, so that's great.

Sebastian Jimenez: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: I love it.

Sebastian Jimenez: [inaudible]

Heidi J. Ellsworth: Well, thank you so much for joining us today. I'm looking forward to having you back again. This is just great. I am super excited about you being a part of the MetalVue program. I think it's just exactly what contractors need, and it's just going to take the industry that one step up. It keeps growing and building. So thank you so much, and thank you for being a part of MetalCoffeeShop.

Sebastian Jimenez: Thank you, Heidi. This was awesome. Thank you.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: Thank you. And thank you all for listening. You can find information on Rillavoice on MetalCoffeeShop. Just go to the directory. You can find all kinds of articles. We're doing some videos, and of course, they're all part of the MetalVue program, so be sure to check that out, first slot on the directory, and you can find out about MetalVue and how you can get these important resources.

Thank you again. Please be sure to go to YouTube and subscribe so you don't miss any episodes, along with your favorite podcast channel. Hit those notifications, and we'll be seeing you next time on MetalCast.