Sasha Demyan & Robert Tiffin - A Sneak Peek at MBCEA 2025 - PODCAST TRANSCRIPT

Editor's note: The following is the transcript of a live interview with  Sasha Demyan and Robert Tiffin from Metal Building Contractors and Erectors Association. You can read the interview below or listen to the podcast.

Intro: Welcome to Metal Cast, the podcast where we're turning up the heat on all things metal roofing. On this show, we'll explore the world of metal roofing from its durability to design expert insights and more. Join us as we bang out the details on the toughest roofs in the game. Get ready to unleash the power of metal roofing. Hello everyone. My name is Megan Ellsworth here@rooferscoffeeshop.com, and you are listening to a Roofing road trip. I'm so excited 'cause I'm here with the folks from N-B-C-E-A, um and we're gonna be talking about their conference coming up and all of the great initiatives they have coming down the pipeline. So, um, Sasha Robert, welcome to the podcast. 

Sasha Demyan: Thank you. It's great to be here. 

Megan Ellsworth: Yay. I'm glad to have you. So, uh, Sasha, I'll start with you. Can you introduce yourself and tell us a little bit about your role with M-B-C-E-A? 

Sasha Demyan: So, I am the executive director of the Metal Building Contractors and Directors Association and I have been since December of 2012. And I'm also the executive director of our sister association, our educational arm, our 5 0 1 C3, the Metal Buildings Institute. 

Megan Ellsworth: Okay, very cool. Robert, uh, who are you <laugh>? 

Robert Tiffin: Well, that's a great question on any given day, but for this, for this all, I'm the, the president of the Metal Building Contractors and Directors Association. I'm also the, the chairperson and this will become relevant a bit later, the chairperson of the architect committee for the Metal Building Manufacturers Association. But then the folks that pay me every day are Silver Coat and I'm part of the national account team for that company. 

Megan Ellsworth: Amazing, amazing. Well, I'm really excited to learn more about MBMA and N-B-C-E-A. Um, can you tell us a little bit about your conference that's coming up? It's the 56th Annual. Um, what can we expect from the conference this year? 

Sasha Demyan: Well, there will be educational sessions, networking sessions and exhibit hall and a golf tournament. It's a time to rekindle old friendships and make new ones. This is the opportunity to have FaceTime with your peers, your customers, your suppliers. It is the only place where everyone there is involved in metal building systems. 

Megan Ellsworth: Pretty cool. And that's May 7th through ninth, right? Robert? 

Robert Tiffin: Correct. In in Charlotte, North Carolina, absolutely. 

Megan Ellsworth: Nice, nice. Okay. Charlotte, what a beautiful time of year to go to Charlotte. That's gonna be beautiful 

Robert Tiffin: Ab Absolutely. So from the inside, the hotel to the golf course looks to be a good time. And if the previous ones are, you'll want to be there. 

Megan Ellsworth: Yeah. Yay. Okay. So what can attendees expect from the agenda for the conference? Are there any new or unique sessions this year that either of you are particularly excited for? 

Sasha Demyan: Yes, absolutely. Two sessions stand out this year for me that I'm excited about. One is a full walkthrough of a project. It's gonna be from the planning stage through delivery and closeout. Now, we would typically have a management and a field track running concurrently at this time, but we feel all personnel will benefit from this session as it as it flows from the office to the job site with the teamwork needed to complete a project successfully. And then the other one is our very popular contractor and director Roundtable, where members can use this as a live forum for the issues they are facing. This year we're going to do it a little bit differently. We're going to break out into smaller groups so the conversations are more focused and then we're going to come back together and share the takeaways from those smaller discussions. 

Megan Ellsworth: Wow, that's exciting. A full project walkthrough that's kind of unique. Um, Robert, what, what are you looking forward to for the sessions this year? 

Robert Tiffin: Well, I personally love the the round tables because here are the folks that are making the buildings and the people that are putting them up. So it's truly an opportunity to say, you know, have the healthy conversation of we need to deliver a quality product. Right? And what I love about this, uh, this transition for this year of each individual table, having a conversation and presenting it to the floor is a little bit organic away from the hay panel. You're the manufacturers and we're out here in the field, or vice versa. So this is a, uh, a new adaptation to try to create better results. Yep. 

Megan Ellsworth: That's awesome. That's really cool. It's, that's what these conferences are really about is just being able to have that, that FaceTime with, you know, your peers in the industry and getting a little insight on what they're doing differently and how you can maybe could work together or what have you. So that's really cool that you're doing that. So, um, the field personnel in management session tracks, um, are back this year. That's exciting. What are they and what makes them so valuable and popular? 

Sasha Demyan: So providing these session tracks means that programming is going to be specific to running your business or training field personnel. So you can bring several employees from your company to education and information relevant to the role that they play. Craig Schafer with Safety Works is our go-to presenter on all things osha. So field personnel will benefit from his session on fall protection, OSHA's new heat illness prevention standard and an update on what's going on with OSHA in 2025. At the same time, management will be learning about litigation risk, having discussions with MBMA members, manufacturers and suppliers during our joint round table time, along with learning about the latest happenings in each of our associations during our association updates. 

Robert Tiffin: So what the, the dual track, I'm just gonna say what the dual tracks bring is we're trying to focus the delivery or the opportunities to the individuals so that it grows so that as Sasha pointed out earlier, your peers be like, Hey Megan, I haven't seen you at the last two and here are the tracks that we're gonna be talking about this year. And it's geared to what your position or your role is, both in your company and what you're looking to do in the industry. So we're trying to create the, uh, the appetizers, if you will, so people will show up. 

Megan Ellsworth: That's great. Yeah. That, that's some powerful stuff, especially bringing people, you know, from the job site in, it's not just upper management coming to attend the conference. That's really cool and a great experience for everyone in a company. Yeah. Love it. Um, okay, before we get too far, I'd love to, um, could either of you give us a little bit of a rundown on the N-B-C-E-A and your partnership with MBMA and kind of how the two associations work together and all that, all that jazz is kind of a curve ball question. 

Robert Tiffin: Absolutely. I'll take this wherever you want, Sasha. 

Megan Ellsworth: Sure. 

Robert Tiffin: You know, in the popular meme languages out there, I was this old when I learned something today, so <laugh> I was thinking about the relationship and I thought I was five, but apparently it's eight years old now. And so the, this combination between the NBCA and the NBMA comes came as a simple answer to the question. Uh, so why are the folks that make the metal building systems not actively talking to the people that put up the metal building systems? And it was that simple question that people were like, that's a fabulous idea. So we had our very first conference and that apparently eight years ago of the combined, we have general the same interests, but then of course that allows us to spin off into respective, uh, education classes for the respective of manufacturer. They have their topics, so we carve out part of the conference specifically for their members. 

Robert Tiffin: And then for the contractors directors, as Sasha pointed out, we have tracks for management as well as the field personnel at any given time. Vendors like myself actually play in both fields. So we, for example, if I speak with my sales hat on for a second, I will drift in to listen to what the manufacturers are talking about for their review. But then I'll also come over to see the field personnel to elevate our game as a vendor partner as also to the ownership so that when we're creating a value stack for that, we understand. So the relationships have grown, I'll say tremendously little nuance things. For example, each of the respective associations have committees, right? From technical committees, marketing committees. So the simple question, why are two marketing committee chairs not talking to each other? How can the, how can a technical committee of NBCA leverage the resources from the MBMA? 'cause they've got on staff, um, licensed engineers. So there's a great opportunity for give and take. And what I really love about the conferences are we get that personal time. So once you've spent five minutes over a plate of appetizers with somebody, any barriers are gone and you feel comfortable calling them to ask questions. And Sasha can concur with this. How many times do you hear, I got a dumb guy question. <laugh>, right? <laugh>. So this conference has alleviated all that, or the questions still get asked, but now there's the laugh when we ask it. 

Sasha Demyan: Yeah, I was going to say, uh, whenever there's a really tough question, it's like, let's ask the MBMA, they're really smart. <laugh> 

Megan Ellsworth: <laugh> love that. That's why you have friends <laugh>. 

Robert Tiffin: The MBMA loves it because they have spent years developing a deep library of white papers, you know, to six decimal places that not everybody uses. But now with the N-B-C-E-A, they tie in or the practical ones, we've had contractors rectors standing on a job site and they have a code official asking them a question or asking them a position statement. They now know who they can call, say Vince Sagan, director of codes and standards at the M-M-B-M-A, Vince will happily get on the phone and work it out right then, right there. And the jobs I can continue. 

Megan Ellsworth: Absolutely. Wow. Okay. Well, thank you for level setting that for me. Um, so Sasha, the conference, the N-B-C-E-A conference is co-located with MB MA's spring meeting. How would you say these networking opportunities enhance the value of the event? 

Sasha Demyan: So speaking back to what, how Robert just kind of explained our association with each other and how that started eight years ago and, um, that that's really the networking opportunities with contractors being able to say to the manufacturers, Hey, here's what we're facing in the field. How can you help us solve that? Um, that's invaluable. That's, you know, our contractors and erectors. We honestly, in the world of metal building construction, we're at the lowest level. So we are always looking to have our voice heard, um, the people in the field. And so having that relationship really gives us that platform to be able to say, Hey, we're the ones putting up your metal buildings. Um, maybe it would be easier if you did this or is it possible to do this with the drawings? And when you deliver, can you do this? You know, how can we get a little more technologically advanced? How can you share your training, uh, information, um, instead of in a, in a booklet maybe as a video, you know, so like we can bounce ideas off of each other and they can say, yeah, that's, that's a great idea or that's not gonna work. You know? And so we have that platform to share with each other the real world things that are going on and help, uh, try and solve them for each other. 

Robert Tiffin: A beautiful example of that happened a couple of years ago. So air infiltration was made its way into the energy code, right? So basically, how much does a metal building system leak air, like homestead back in the early two thousands? So the MBMA wants to get ahead of that because it's not as simple in a metal building system as it's in the residential world. So they created a task force, well, to do the testing they needed contractor director. So it was a great symbiotic relationship. We went across seven buildings, across five, um, climate zones, all utilizing active NBCA accredited members to make that happen. So it's a a real world application of networking top to bottom, left to right to deliver a result. 

Sasha Demyan: Yeah, and I'd like to speak about something else when we talk about the value of these opportunities being co-located. Um, we're excited to announce that the exhibit hall officially sold out two weeks ago. This proves how valuable our industry members, manufacturers and suppliers and other vendors feel. Their participation is with the contractors on Erectors sponsor went quickly as well. Again, validating. This is the place where our industry members know that metal building systems contractors and directors are going to be. And they don't wanna miss the opportunity to get their brand out there. Of course, they're all in full support of our association and the industry. 

Robert Tiffin: I think there's even a waiting list, isn't there, Sasha? 

Sasha Demyan: There is a waiting list and I am working through that waiting list in the, uh, exhibit hall 

Megan Ellsworth: <laugh>. Wow. Well that's exciting. Congratulations. That's huge. 

Robert Tiffin: Oh, it is. And then the fun part from being a vendor, you know, to the sponsorship ideas, as Sasha pointed out, well say there's some, uh, friendly scrappiness involved between vendors to get the, the best opportunities, but it comes down to, you know, the return on investment. For example, I did the quick math for Sasha. If a flight's 500 and a hotel room's 1 75 or one 50 and then a rental car to visit one customer, I can now do this and I can meet with hundreds of customers and prospects in the same place. So from that standpoint, the old phrase of it's a no-brainer, it's still a no-brainer. 

Megan Ellsworth: Yeah, that's so true. That's so true. And it's like that with, with any industry event, um, like this, they're just so important to lend ease of, um, ease of seeing each other and being in person and having that FaceTime. It's so important. Okay. So N-B-C-E-A has a very rich history. Um, it was founded in 1968, if I'm correct. Right. And um, so how would you say the association has evolved over the years and maybe what are you most proud of, um, out of that progress you've made? 

Sasha Demyan: Well, it's gone through several name changes and membership profile percentages of manufacturers and suppliers to contractors and directors. So, uh, dealers maybe heavier on the manufacturer side, um, through dips and then regrowth since my involvement a little over 12 years ago, membership has almost quadrupled. So I am so proud of that. Um, when, uh, I came on board and it was more, um, contract not contractor, it was more industry member heavy, more manufacturer, more supplier heavy. And, uh, we have tipped the scales now and we are now more contractor and ector heavy, which was our goal obviously, um, for the contractors and Erectors association. So that's where the focus really is. And the conference has once again become the premier destination for the metal building systems industry. So I'm super proud also of the growth and the participation we have at the conference level, um, with everyone that's involved. 

Megan Ellsworth: Wow, that's great. Congratulations. Quadrupling the membership. That's massive <laugh>. 

Robert Tiffin: And so to that point, just a couple of things. Like for example, we have other locations that wanna start up local chapters, right? So for example, Sasha and I were on a call just a couple of hours ago for the Tennessee Valley that actively wants to get involved. What's beautiful about the conversation is that they, that they know the names and locations of other chapters that they want to emulate. But I would say the most proud that we are is of Sasha because this year she's the 2024 Hall of Fame inductee for our industry and all the work that she's done in our industry, it's a pinnacle to a, you know, she's not done her career. Clearly not. But it's a great milestone in that trajectory. So just wanna make sure we get that on the record. 

Megan Ellsworth: Wow, congratulations. Oh my gosh, 

Sasha Demyan: I'm glad this wasn't the platform that Robert sprang the surprise on me <laugh>, because if you would've seen that reaction, <laugh>, 

Megan Ellsworth: I love it. 

Robert Tiffin: We did our best Megan, to keep it a secret. So we, we nominated Sasha and then went through, the only reason why we had to disclose it a month, it'll be announced at our conference. So we're bringing back the Hall of Fame to our conference, so it'll be announced. But the challenge is the organization that puts on the hall or sponsors the Hall of Fame also publishes a magazine a month early. So we felt it appropriate to, uh, to let Sasha know ahead of time. So anyway, the, the pro the happiness for our industry and everybody's show up through Sasha. 

Megan Ellsworth: I love it. Well, congratulations, Sasha. That is huge accomplishment and very well deserved. 

Sasha Demyan: Thanks. It's a huge honor. I'll, I'll be, uh, very proud to accept it at the conference, <laugh>. 

Megan Ellsworth: Oh yeah, that's awesome. Oh, I love it. Okay. So N-B-C-E-A has really played a big role, um, in developing the quality in craftsmanship training series. How do these training programs help improve the skillsets of those in the metal building industry? 

Sasha Demyan: Right. So metal building systems are unique and schools just don't teach how to assemble them. We consider this a general overview of each phase of Metal building Assembly and have trained and enabled companies to train thousands in safe and correct metal building assembly. And N-B-C-E-A members have free access to this Metal Buildings Institute 11 module video series. So it is, um, it's a great, it's a great product. Uh, we're building off of it and I think we'll talk a little bit more about that later. Uh, what, what the next steps are, um, to this great platform, uh, that we have the Quality and Craftsmanship training series. Um, we've added ips, we've added Retrofit Roofing, uh, so through our educational arm, the Metal Buildings Institute, we've been able to, uh, create a lot of great, uh, training for this, uh, niche market. 

Megan Ellsworth: Rob, can you kind of dive into what, what has your experience been with the Quality and Craftsmanship training series? Um, have, do you know anyone that's taken it? 

Robert Tiffin: Yes. Well, I've taken it so I, so Oh good. 

Robert Tiffin: This is where, and I'll, I'll jump off of where Sasha said it was established. So today it's a video series, right? So we actually have used parts of it, the one particular, the insulation section for part of our onboarding session. 'cause it's a great video to watch. So for the technology and the, the depth of education, it's fabulous, but it's a leaping pad to what we're gonna be talking about next, which is the education for the future. Because right now it's a, you sit in a chair and you watch a video, you can replay it and catch up, but it quickly gets you immersed in what, first of all, simplistic, what's a metal building system? What are the components? And as I was sharing earlier, we specifically say watch the insulation section so you can be at least comfortable when you hear certain terminology. And then that'll be the beginning of your journey into a metal building system. And in our case, insulate it. Yep. 

Sasha Demyan: What's also great about the program is that it is in English and Spanish. So it really helps out a lot of our contractors and erectors with their, um, labor force, uh, some that don't speak English. And so it's, it's very helpful in that regard as well. 

Megan Ellsworth: Yeah, that's great. The more bilingual assets we as an industry can have, the better because, um, people wanna learn in their native language, so why not? Why not provide that for them? Um, the NBCA obviously focuses a lot on educating and inspiring people and specifically younger generations, um, about the middle industry, middle building industry. Can you talk a little bit on any initiatives or programs aimed at reaching the next generation of these professionals coming in? 

Sasha Demyan: So the Mid-Atlantic chapter actively supports, um, a camp that's called Let's Build Construction Camp for Girls. It introduces, yeah, it's great, it's great. It introduces all the trades to middle and high school girls during a two week camp. Now this one takes place in my backyard, so I'm able to go, I'm able to, to see the girls at the end, um, because of the level that we're able to sponsor at, we can take, um, a lot of fun stuff and give them some inspiring thing, you know, words at the end of their camp, we can see what they built. So it's a lot of fun. It takes place also in Arizona and Ohio. So we are really pushing our members and really just all construction professionals. I would encourage to support in some way. If there's a camp local to you, it's, it's a fantastic program. 

Sasha Demyan: And then on the N-B-C-E-A side, uh, personally our assets, um, we have videos and customizable presentations that we've created for our members to use in their local career days in order to, in introduce careers and construction. And we have many that use these, we have many, uh, individual through the chapters or individual, uh, companies that are our members that will go to their local career days, um, in and, you know, have these, have these opportunities to speak and use the, the videos and the customizable presentations that we have. Um, there are so many great, uh, things out there that MBMA has put out that Build Your future.org has put out. So, uh, we really, um, took that workforce development, uh, to Heart year a few years ago. And under Keith Wentworth as the president of, um, M-B-C-E-A at the time and now MBI, uh, you know, we got all of the associations together and we all talked about, you know, the, the workforce, the, the lack of and what we can do to inspire the younger generation. So, um, we had some really great discussions and we really got together with social media, with sharing all the resources that all of the, uh, trade associations have, um, in the metal building world. And so really we've got a great page on our website, uh, for the public to go to, to see all of these great assets. 

Megan Ellsworth: That's great. I love the Let's build construction camp for girls. I'm friends with Leanne Slattery and Shelly Higgins. So they, Shelly puts on the Ohio camp and Leanne I think helps with the, with the Allen Allentown. Um, yeah. And it's just so cool. I would've loved that as a kid. So I think that's just huge for this industry really recruiting the next generation of not only our workforce, but women. And I think that's so, so awesome. So that's great that you guys work with them. 

Robert Tiffin: So to, to play off of that and then to jump off of the, the video, the quality and craftsmanship series is we have a lot of resources, right, from the people that are in the field, A lot of anecdotal, a lot of hands-on experience. How do you capture all that to today's learning style? So we've partnered with an organization, the N-C-E-N-C-E-R. I catch myself on that every single time. This, this is a, another, um, nonprofit organization that they specialize in, basically listening. So listening to us and all the experience and how we put all this together and they created online curriculum, why this is important. We've had great traction. We actually went out to technical schools and some colleges wanting to talk about metal billing assemblers as an actual class in their school. Everyone loved the idea, but you have to come to the table with a full, fully developed curriculum. 

Robert Tiffin: They won't write it for you. So when we found the NA CER and we're working through it now, in fact, I had a, a meeting an hour ago on the unit seven on installation. So this is a collaboration of the industry getting together to write. Now you love this Megan. It's auditory, it's visual and it's tactile. So we're taking considerations, different learning styles and it's not one whereby you've seen another training where you press play, you go vacuum the house, make a sandwich, come back and then you're certified, right? You've got to, there's mini tests halfway through is a barometer. Have you learned something? There's interactions, there's a reading portion, there's a voice over the reading portion. There's tests at the end before you can progress. Then there's the managerial view so that you're, if you are an employer or a contractor or rector, we can see where you are in this stage and we're helping our contractors or rectors or we will help them even put that as an incentive to learn or an incentive to a different pay scale. So we're thinking all the different ways this education online can be done at their pace, expand their knowledge, quickly, identify, we'll call them up and comers to use an old phrase, but to make sure there's a consistency of teaching across the us That's our latest initiative. It's a pretty big one, but I would say everybody from contractors or rectors to manufacturers to vendors we're all in and heavily sponsored to get it done. 

Megan Ellsworth: Wow, that's awesome. I love that it's auditory, visual and tactile because so many people are hands-on learners. That's so important. Love. Great. Okay, so we are at our last question already. This is flown by. Um, so as we look forward, um, into the future of the metal building industry, what role do you see N-B-C-E-A is shaping the industry's growth, technology adoption and and safety standards? 

Sasha Demyan: Well we're, we will continue to drive quality programs like the international accreditation, uh, services AC 4 78 accreditation for assemblers to help contractors and erectors stand out from the pac. We'll continue to push safety awareness like the need for temporary bracing to underscore or ensure safe job sites for metal building. Assemblers, our technical committee will keep our finger on the pulse of code changes and potential changes and work to influence them and then educate our members on how to meet those changes. 

Robert Tiffin: And then with the alignment, going back to our relationship with the MBMA, right? So step by step for example, everything that mentioned that, that Sasha has mentioned tie into the MBMA. So code changes working with Vince Sagan, the director of codes and standards, they sit on the board or actively involved in the IECC, another acronym I know. But these international, the International Code Councils, the folks that actually write then approve the code for buildings. So we have a voice now in those environments from the MBMA relationship. So that filters back through of, okay, so that's the rule, how do we build to it? That's the relationship that we have. The other is, and this is a little bit more of a fun, I'll put on my committee chair for the architects for MBMA. I said, okay, so we're great with engineers, we're great with contractors, erectors, we have an attorney on retainer and we have insurance people helping us understand the language of how metal billing system can be more viable. 

Robert Tiffin: What we're missing as an architect. So last year was our first this year, um, in Boston, June 5th, the seventh will be the second M-B-M-A-M-B-C-A industry participation in the architects conference. 15,000 architects and specifiers in one spot. If it fits my sales guy mantra of I want to be where my prospects meet, eat, sleep, I'm just shy of a stalker, but be to be there going as an industry to show them that a metal billing system is a viable choice and a strong choice for their next need for a building. So going into the future, more of that side comment, we've actually, this will be, we just celebrated our fourth annual design competition for architect students. So tying in this is where the NBCA works step by step. Because if we're going to make buildings more, because the architects are specifying, are we keeping the contractors and erectors involved to make sure that they know how to put up these, these metal buildings, right? So the future involves, and sausage has heard me say this, everyone in our day is always said, I want a larger slice of the pie, right? I want more of the market, I want the slice of the pie. I don't care, I just want a bigger pie. If we bigger pie, everyone gets a bigger slice. So that's sort of where we're headed of making sure that we check out opportunities, we leverage our skills and our, uh, education and we've got great people, great solid people of the NBCA that'll help us get it done. 

Megan Ellsworth: Yeah, absolutely. I love that. Just get a bigger pie. Love it. Let's make the pie bigger. <laugh>. I think that's great. And I think were you, that's the a i A conference, right? Love it. Okay. So if anyone out there listening is going to that conference, make sure to come say hi to Robert and Sasha and anyone else that's there from the N-B-C-E-A, that's really exciting. So hopefully you'll get lots of, uh, architects coming and chatting with you. Yeah, well thank you both so much. Everyone out there listening can go to roofers coffee shop.com and metal coffee shop.com to the N-B-C-E-A and MBMA directories to learn more, get registered for the conference if there's still time. I, I think there is. And um, don't miss out 'cause it's gonna be a really special event. May 7th to the ninth, 2025 in Charlotte, North Carolina. I just, this is so exciting. So Sasha, Robert, thank you for chatting with me. 

Sasha Demyan: Absolutely. Thanks for the opportunity. 

Robert Tiffin: My pleasure. Thank you Megan. Have a great rest of your day. 

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