Rob Drew and Jeremy Grimes - Introducing FlashCo’s New Fall Protection Line - PODCAST TRANSCRIPTION

Editor's note: The following is the transcript of a live interview with Rob Drew and Jeremy Grimes of FlashCo. You can read the interview below or listen to the podcast. 

Speaker 1: Welcome to Roofing Road Trips with Heidi. Explore the roofing industry through the eyes of a long-term professional within the trade. Listen for insights, interviews and exciting news in the roofing industry today.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: Hello and welcome to another Roofing Road Trips from RoofersCoffeeShop. My name is Heidi Ellsworth and we're here today to talk about something incredibly important, and that is rooftop safety. We have been focusing on this in our podcast lately because there's just nothing more important than having people go home safe. And that means all the installers who are installing the roofs, but also the building owners who continue to get up on the roof to do maintenance. We brought in our friends from FlashCo to talk about the importance of permanent safety on fall protection. So I'd love to introduce Rob Drew, the marketing manager with FlashCo and Jeremy Grimes, the safety sales specialist also with FlashCo. Gentlemen, welcome to the show.

Rob Drew: Thanks Heidi. It's really great to be here.

Jeremy Grimes: Hi, Heidi. Thank you.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: Thank you. This is such an important topic. I think it's something that we really need to be talking about all the time. And so before we get into that because there's a lot to talk about, I would love to have you both introduce yourselves and talk a little bit about your company and your product line. So Rob, let's start with you.

Rob Drew: Yeah, so Rob Drew, marketing manager here at FlashCo. You've probably known us for the last 20 years. Up on the roof we do quite a bit of single ply flashings and accessories. We also still have a lead product line that's used for built up and also residential. We've got a real big footprint there. Coated metal, painted metal, a really big product line there. And then this is a new one for us to bring on rooftop safety and fall protection. I'll let Jeremy get into it a little bit more, but really excited to have this in our product mix.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: Jeremy, I'm excited to get to know you better too. Please introduce yourself.

Jeremy Grimes: Hey, thank you Rob for the introduction. Jeremy Grimes, based out of the FlashCo Chicago office. Been in building envelope sales the better part of 20 years ever since college. Started out my career in the Roofers Union, so started out as a roofer, worked my way up, and six years in a previous life as national sales manager for a permanent specified fall protection company in my career journey. So pretty heavily involved with the waterproofing as well as the fall protection. So well versed in this category and excited that FlashCo's embarking in the product line.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: Yeah, it's pretty exciting. Rob, I know you guys and Jeremy introduced it at IRE. We had you on the sound stage talking about it. So maybe, Jeremy, can you tell us a little bit about your whole line of fall protection products?

Jeremy Grimes: Right, so what we're starting out with the initial launch is as a two-pronged approach, and we'll build upon that. Right now it's a horizontal lifeline system as well as our tieback anchor systems. So horizontal lifeline basically it's compatible to work on all roof decking, concrete, wood, metal standing seam metal, our panel trapezoidal roofs. And then our tieback anchor system is more of a fixed anchor that's designed for window washing. So the horizontal lifeline is meant to be a secondary. If you do fall, it is fall arrest or fall restraint. And the tieback product basically the intention is to fall off the roof so it won't collapse or activate if an event does occur.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: Wow, okay. Important pieces of equipment on the roof. I want to get more into that too, but let's talk a little bit about what we're hearing from OSHA right now. Obviously OSHA isn't just about roofing, it's about the building owners, facility managers, everything out there, but there's a lot going on with fall protection. Rob, let's start with you. You just were talking about some new information that's been coming out from OSHA through NRCA.

Rob Drew: Yeah, there was a timely article yesterday that NRCA had in their email newsletter pointing out that OSHA's got a national emphasis program to prevent falls. They had some statistics in there about workplace fatalities, and 13% of those in 2021 were from falls from elevation. And so it's a real emphasis from OSHA to be able to prevent those fatalities. What the article points out is that they're launching this program in concert with the National Safety Stand-Down to prevent falls and construction in the industry, and also this follows on the heels of safety week as well. So a lot of emphasis from OSHA to really prevent these fatalities and falls from happening in first place.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: We're seeing it so much. We just had NRCA on this podcast also talking about that. Jeremy, also, we are so focused in our industry thinking about the workers, the installers who are up on the roof and having fall protection and having all the right equipment. But really once a job is done, the building owners, the facility managers, they need that permanent installation of fall protection equipment. What are you hearing about that with OSHA and building owners?

Jeremy Grimes: Right, so if you look at OSHA, it's really into two categories. OSHA 1910 covers general industry and then 1926 covers the construction industry. What we're focused on primarily is 1910 general industry products that are specified to be on for the life of the roof, 20-25 years, high end materials, stainless steel, aluminum, marine grade cable. Basically for the workers that are coming up there doing maintenance, changing filters, a lot of that work that will occur for the duration of the roof, not just during the construction phase. So that's one thing that we really want to differentiate here is this is intended to be specified and permanent product typically division five, division seven, division 11 are going to be your CSI spec sections that are going to call this out. But really to your point, Heidi, it is meant to be a permanent system for workers continuing duration maintenance on the roof of the life of the building.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: And required for them to have that.

Jeremy Grimes: Correct. Within six foot, 15 foot, they really get in from the roof edge. They really get into some nomenclature there. But if you are within those danger zones, there are fall protection requirements.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: So let's start with talking about, okay, this whole process of the specified safety equipment up there permanently, but when the contractors are installing it, how important is this into the lives of roofing professionals, all the safety and all the safety equipment and all the new products that are coming out to make it even safer?

Jeremy Grimes: Well, for the roofing contractor it's very important. First pushback that we'll see from the roofing contractor historically is liability. They'll say that they don't want to assume that liability, and we understand that. We've got ways to alleviate that pain, but the importance to them is they're going to see this. They're going to be the first ones to look at this, whether it be new construction or it's great for retrofit. I mean, 80% of roofs today are re-roofs. There's a huge market to where roofing contractors should not be saying no to this business. We can get them in contact with certified installers, engineering firms. Basically, we can put together a team that can fill the project and still meet the watertight obligations, the warranties, everything required to complete the project successfully.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: And it's a differentiator for them to the building owners also that they can offer these kind of services and offer this type of permanent protection.

Jeremy Grimes: Correct, absolutely. It really is just an add-on sale. It's not going away. So it is something that we need to accommodate and find a way to provide the owners what their building needs are.

Rob Drew: As Jeremy mentioned, it's a dual solution in terms of not only are we able to supply them with the product, but that certified installer is really important. When we've been out at shows and introducing this, a lot of roofers will say that they wish they had this on prior projects where maybe the owner had asked them for it, and they kind of turned it away because of that liability issue. But with us being able to bring the product and the certified installers and put together, as Jerry mentioned, that whole package, they don't have to turn it down now.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: That's really unique. That's not happening to me. I haven't heard of that happening before, Rob. So that's a big difference out there in the industry, isn't it?

Rob Drew: Yeah, I think I'll let Jeremy speak to it, but I think it's something that we think is really important that from a roofer standpoint you don't have to say I can't really help you with that. So being able to come to us from the beginning of that project and be able to put it together from there. Yeah, I think it's a really good piece to have in the industry and in the market here.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: So, Jeremy, I'd like to just make sure we have everyone out there on the same page when we're looking at the difference between the horizontal lifeline and the tieback anchors. You kind of talked about this earlier on, but as contractors are kind of looking at this and trying to figure out, okay, what are we installing? What's permanent? How's this working? Kind of explain all that.

Jeremy Grimes: Right. And that's where we want to get involved early on and where we can provide the expertise. What's the need? What's the problem? Is this something to where you're doing facade access, facade maintenance? Are you doing masonry restoration? Why are you going to be accessing the roof? Or is this something where it's just going to be routine maintenance and they just need a lifeline to tie off so they're in compliance when they're on the roof? So getting us involved early to do the analysis to take a look, you might only need 20% of that roof covered in fall protection. You might not need four miles of lifeline. We can get in and help make the right determination. Like I said, as the lifeline, it'll have you tied off for the duration that you're on the roof doing the work from A to B to C. The tieback anchors will secure you and tie you off if you are going to be leaving the edge of the building like a swing stage or something along those lines.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: Window washing.

Jeremy Grimes: Window cleaning exactly would be a great example.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: Okay. Once you get in early with them, with the contractors, to kind of understand the needs of the roof and the permanent safety, the contractor can either perform the work or you can bring in certified installers. What if the contractor wants to perform that work, how do they get trained and certified?

Jeremy Grimes: Yeah, that's a great question. If a roofing contractor does want to perform the work, absolutely we would love to partner with them because then they can handle the waterproofing and the flashings. They're all there at the same time. It can handle it. As far as that goes, these are engineered systems, so there is a certification class that's involved. You can either come to one of the nine FlashCo locations nationwide or we can come to the roofer shop and perform those classes, those certifications. Try to limit those to about six attendees per session. And the reason being is we want to do it in an eight hour day maximum. There's a little bit of classroom work involved, and then there's hands-on applications. It's a pass fail. We'll provide the product and the equipment. We just want to see that the contractor's comfortable in performing the work. I think once they get their hands on it and see what an efficient and user-friendly and clean system this is to install, a lot of that liability will alleviate itself.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: And if they don't want to get trained, then you bring in the certified contractors, as Rob said, to do the work for them so that they can make this all part of one big project.

Jeremy Grimes: Correct. And we have. We're building an installed network nationwide. Depending on trades and labor and state licensing and regulations, we'll know ahead of time to bring the right contractor into the right project to make sure that it does move smoothly. It's something we do fully understand and we'll make sure that we were compatible with that entire project as far as labor regulations.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: So earlier on when we were talking, and Rob, I think maybe you had brought this up, but some contractors are worried about the risk and liability, but yet on the other side of it, it seems to me like this would help mitigate risk and liability because you'd have that on there. What are some of the things, either Rob or Jeremy, what are some of the things that you're hearing out there around that?

Rob Drew: Well, we're definitely hearing that there's a need out there. That's number one. As Jeremy mentioned, we released this at the IRE show, and there's really a ton of interest in terms of seeing exactly how it works. We were able to demonstrate it right there in terms of the modular nature of what we have, the ability to put it on all different types of roofs as well, that there's a continuous connection, things like that. So we were able to demonstrate that at the show. And so a tremendous amount of interest I think because contractors, obviously as we talked about, OSHA is really pushing on the safety especially for falls. And so there's a lot of interest in the industry and making everything safe obviously. And then that's trickling down I think to the roofing contractor as the first point of contact to say, "Hey, you're the expert on my roof here. From a building standpoint, we need to add fall protection as OSHA is telling us. So how do we go about doing that?"

And so as they look out there at the landscape, what are my options? And so really from the roofing contractors point of view, also the architect or the consultant who might be on particular jobs offering all of them, here are all your different options that you might have for fall protection on this particular project. So as Jeremy said, getting involved early on lets us give them that full range of options that we can offer.

Jeremy Grimes: Rob, just to build on that a little bit, I think a lot of it from the roofing, from the division seven side, it's the fear of the unknown. The fall protection industry has not historically done a really good job immersing themselves into the building envelope, into the roofing, into the waterproofing world. And it's kind of this 800 pound monster in the corner that seems like it's daunting and there's liability, and there's just a lot more to it than there really is. And that's one of the beauties of FlashCo that we're bringing together is our expertise of the flashings, the waterproofing, the envelope of the structure of the building as well as the fall protection. So I think we're doing a really nice service to the roofing contractor to be able to provide a full understanding of the entire package, not just staying in our lane with we are fall protection or we are flashings. We're really marrying the two together and telling a great story.

Rob Drew: And we've got that 20 years of experience going on, well, actually now up to 23, I should say. Started in 2020. So all that experience of being on those roofs to bring to these projects, as Jeremy mentioned, the waterproofing aspect of it and just understanding what the roofing contractor goes through from beginning to end on a particular project be it a re-roof or what have you. So really understanding the roofer's point of view on a lot of this, I think, is something that's useful.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: Yeah, it makes big difference. And I'm going to say FlashCo would have started in 2000.

Rob Drew: That's right. FlashCo started in 2000.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: Yeah. Jeremy, I'm going to take this, you just said it again, and I just want to make sure everybody out there is really clear. This is a specified product. In many cases, depending on everything, it's required by code. And so for contractors, really this helps mitigate risk by doing it correctly with certified installers. Correct?

Jeremy Grimes: Correct. As long as the contractor is certified and as long as there's a PE within that state involved in the project, FlashCo will execute the contract with that certified installer. Again, yeah, it is spec driven. It's not a temporary solution. This is not something that's designed when the roof is completed, it goes with the roofer. And the roofer is probably going to be doing work on that roof again in the next 20 years, whether it be in visual inspections or drain cleaning or just general maintenance of that roof structure. This will give them something to tie off to and not have to basically reinvent the wheel every time they're back on the field of that roof.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: So savings especially for service and maintenance programs.

Jeremy Grimes: Absolutely.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: Okay, gentlemen, this is all amazing, and what a great program you have. How can roofing companies sign up for it, Rob?

Rob Drew: Yeah, so we got a whole fall protection section on our website. That's really a good place to start. As Jeremy mentioned, we've got nine locations. We've got outside Salesforce in all those locations throughout the country, so you can reach out that way locally to your sales rep. The website is flashco.com/fall protection, so that's a really great place to start. There's a form on there where you can request information, and we'll put you in touch with Jeremy who can kind of guide contractors through a particular project that they have coming up. So that's the quick and easy way or several ways that you can get in touch with us.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: Jeremy, last thoughts on how important this is?

Jeremy Grimes: It's critical. It's not going anywhere. I think Rob talked a little bit about the falls, the data. It's really number two in the industry behind driving. Everybody in some point or shape or form drives. But falls from height is at the very top of the leading cause of fatalities. It's really hard to quantify and put a dollar amount. A fall could be upwards of millions of dollars of liability assuming that that's a fatality. By the time you talk about litigation and expenses and fines, and that's assuming there's a fatality. If there's not a fatality, someone could be on the liability for the duration of that injured individual's medical care for duration. So there's a lot of serious implications dollar-wise attached to not having fall protection. A lot of your facilities, great markets to look at higher education, college campuses, a lot of squares, a lot of buildings, military basis, Fortune 500 companies, just kind of a ballpark of some of the ideal facilities that would be great candidates for fall protection. Just to really drive it home, the most expensive fall protection is no fall protection.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: Exactly. Well said. And thank you. Thank you very much. Thank you both, Rob, Jeremy. This has been great. Super informative and critical right now, as you were saying, Jeremy. Rob, any last words?

Rob Drew: Just thank you for having us, Heidi. We're really excited to get the word out about this product line. This isn't where we're stopping on fall protection either. We're going to keep going with additional products from here as well. This is an area product line that we're really committed to, and so there's going to be more that gets built upon this as well. We're really excited to not only have what we have now, but then build on it as we go forward as well.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: That's excellent. That's excellent. Thank you. Thank you so much. Rob and Jeremy, we want to have you back on those new products too.

Jeremy Grimes: For sure. Thank you, Heidi.

Rob Drew: Thank you, Heidi. Appreciate your time.

Heidi J. Ellsworth: Thank you both, and thank you all for listening. This is the kind of information that we try to bring on every podcast that can help grow your business and save lives. So be sure to check out the directory for FlashCo. We have all this information on there, some great articles coming out on safety and file protection. Go check it all out on Roofers Coffee Shop in the FlashCo directory. Also, be sure to check out all of our podcasts under the read list and watch navigation Roofing Road Trips or on your favorite podcast channel. Be sure to subscribe and set those notifications so you don't miss a single episode. We'll be seeing you next time on Roofing Road Trips.

Speaker 1: Make sure to subscribe to our channel and leave a review. Thanks for listening. This has been Roofing Road Trips with Heidi from the rooferscoffeeshop.com.