Adding Metal - MCSI Influencer Kyle Nurminen - PODCAST TRANCSRIPT

Intro: Okay. Hello, everyone. My name's Megan Ellsworth here at metalcoffeeshop.com. I'm so excited. I'm here chatting with my friend Kyle Nurminen for an MCS Influencer Response for the month of July. Hi, friend. Hi, Kyle. How are you?

Kyle Nurminen: Hey, Megan. Hey. Nice to get with you again. I was excited about this one.

Megan Ellsworth: Yay. I am too. Okay-

Kyle Nurminen: For obvious reasons.

Megan Ellsworth: ... so this month's question... Yes. We love being with friends and we love talking about metal roofing. This month's question is, more contractors are looking to get into metal; what is your advice for adding metal construction to a contracting business?

Kyle Nurminen: At first, I wanted to figure out a way to break this down. I got it broken down into a three-part answer here. And I think the very first thing that any company needs to take a look at... And please don't take offense. I'm not telling anybody how to run their company here. But if you've ever heard of the book... Did you ever hear the book From Good to Great by Jim Collins?

Megan Ellsworth: Actually no, but maybe I should read it.

Kyle Nurminen: It's a review of what people, the companies, like the Walmarts versus their competitors, how did they go to great while their other competitors just kind of stayed good? And there were two main things, level-five leadership versus level-one or level-four. So level-four leaders, more about themselves, level-five leaders, more about the company as a whole. And then the level-five leaders, the first move that they made when they got in there is fine-tuned the process of what we're good at. There's so many roofers out there that want to do everything for everybody. Don't get into metal because you just want to do everything with everybody.

So that leads into my first point is really is what is your market now? What is your niche? What are you best at? Because metal spans the whole spectrum, and people don't realize that. And even doing all metal is difficult. We typically don't do 5d. We can offer it, but it's always easy for our crews that do high-end architecture on large-standing seam to go down to 5d. But you know what? We could still make mistakes because they're just not used to doing it. So number one question is, what is your market? Okay? What other style of roofs are you doing? What price range are you in? Are you in the lower end of the market? Are you in the middle of the market, and be honest with yourself or you're in higher end of the market? Don't use metal right now to make the leap. May use metal now to match what you're already doing. Okay? So that's my first thing.

And I know this is my second, my kind of B to that, is keep in mind where you're at in a nation because this is a national podcast. I'm in Florida. So metal has different strengths and weaknesses, pros and cons, compared to other roof systems in Florida than it does up in Michigan. So make sure you understand your climate and your atmosphere and your pros and cons of metal roofing compared to the other types of systems that you're doing.

Megan Ellsworth: Yeah. Absolutely.

Kyle Nurminen: Right? I kind of already skimmed right over it, but what are you going to focus on? Are you going to focus on lower-end metal? Are you going to focus on residential, or you going to focus on commercial? You can do a lot, multifamily. So you basically have three categories of your residential, your commercial or your marketing or your multi-residential. But what is your company geared for? Some people want to take a bid and put a bid in on anything on a multi-residential, and they don't really have the production capability to do multi-residential. Commercial roofers don't really have the account management tools, or CRM's not even set up the same way for a commercial roofing company as it is for residential. So if you're just thinking about doing metal on a residential side only, kind of start... I don't know. I wouldn't try to use metal to move your company off of step one. That make sense?

Megan Ellsworth: That's really good advice.

Kyle Nurminen: You know me, I get yappy. I say too much sometimes.

Megan Ellsworth: No, that's perfect. I think that was perfectly well-said because sometimes it's nice to have advice where it's just step-by-step. Those are really top tips that you gave, and I think starting where people are at is really important. You don't want to make, like you said, that leap and bite off more than you can chew. Just start small. Start implementing metal in small ways and then work your way up, and then before you know it, you'll be doing metal roofs all the time.

Kyle Nurminen: There's still obstacles you need to consider, though, before you even do that. Those are my other two points. Do you have a crew right now that you can train to do metal, or do you want to sub a crew? Total Roofing inquired... We took on the name The Metal Roof Experts. 50% of our business is installs for other companies that don't have install crews. There are companies out there that will do really good installs for you to get you into market. You might not take as much of a margin on it, but you might make that up in volume, especially... Even if you're at the lower end of the price range, you may make it up in volume and have somebody else sub that. But then again, those are smaller projects usually, but if you're small multi-residential lower end, like putting 5d or replacing shingle, you can use an installer to slap that down. It doesn't take long for you to get somebody, and you can make a decision from there.

Now at this point, how much of my market is actually going to be metal, realistically, for what I thought I was going to fit into my current portfolio and where I'm at in the market and is it worth now hiring a crew? Can I retain a crew? Can I keep a crew, that specialist? Can I give them enough work to keep them moving on metal all the time? It's difficult to find crews that are good at all three, at shingle and tile and metal, so you always got to keep that in mind. And it's nothing wrong with being upfront, saying, "We do the tear off. We do this. This is us. This is our company. These are who we trust to do the installs because they're the best. We don't do a lot of it, but when we do, we choose the best people." Some people try to cover up that they're subbing. Don't really have to do it that way. That's just my opinion. Like I said, I'm not trying to tell anybody how to run their business. But that's an option.

And then that leads into the third. Once you've decided that, who's going to do the work and how am I going to progress in this labor-wise, what about distribution-wise? Total Roofing is sister partners with Dynamic Metals. Of course we're going to use Dynamic Metals for our metal roof installs, but that doesn't mean we can't install other manufacturers as well when it's specified. And the reverse is true. Some people don't bid enough metal work to really have a relationship with somebody like a Dynamic Metals, so they'll just go through distribution. There's a whole list of pros and cons that come with going either way, whether you're reduced in options by one certain manufacturer or whether your supply is restricted or your consistency and material can be more or less consistent depending on which manufacturer and which distributor you use.

There's all these factors that come into play, but those are kind of things you want to have a discussion with your team, where we're at now. How do we want to work our way in the metal and with what we have? What are we going to do labor-wise? What works for us? What are we most comfortable with? Do we have a plan B or installer if our guys can't do it? And then what route do we want to go? What arena do we want to play in? Because, to be honest with you, sometimes when you're manufacturing and the installer, yes, you can be a lot more competitive in a lot of ways. But we battle that with us not being specified on a lot of variables, too, because supply options are mostly specified on larger projects, architects and engineers and new construction. So it goes both ways. What's in your neighborhood? What do you want to do?

Megan Ellsworth: Yeah. Absolutely. Well, thank you so much, Kyle, for the great advice. We really appreciate you being an influencer and spreading your wealth of knowledge, so thank you.

Kyle Nurminen: I've been in this 20 years, so anybody out there to call me... My initials are KAN. I keep it candid. I'm going to tell you like it is. I'm going to tell you like it is whether you want to hear it or not. So anybody's willing to drop me an email. I'm on LinkedIn. Look me up on LinkedIn, see what I do, private message with questions. I have so many podcasts I've done with you guys that are educational. We're not perfect. Every company has its strengths and weaknesses. It's roofing. We're all screwed up. We're all battling the same battles on different levels, strengths and weaknesses. So I'm always willing to put in my two cents, and that does not mean that I know any better than anybody else. But this is what RoofersCoffeeShop and AskARoofer's all about, us being a community and helping one another, and I'm always willing to do it.

Megan Ellsworth: Absolutely. I love it.

Kyle Nurminen: Thank you for the opportunity.

Megan Ellsworth: Absolutely. Oh my gosh. So everyone out there listening, go to metalcoffeeshop.com or askaroofer or rooferscoffeeshop.com to learn more about The Metal Roof Experts and Kyle. Thank you again, Kyle. I'll chat with you next month.

Outro: My pleasure. All right, take care. Be blessed.